In this week's podcast episode (#66, "Stripping Away"), musicians Carly Simon and Heather Maloney share interviews with RockOm. Carly talks about stripping down her hits for the new album Never Been Gone and singer-songwriter Heather Maloney shares about the stripping away process that occurs in meditation.
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Carly Simon needs no introduction. Since 1971 her music and hits such as "That's the Way I've Always Heard It Should Be", “Anticipation”, “You’re So Vain” and many others have been part of the soundtrack of millions of lives around the world. Her 1973 album No Secrets rocketed to #1 on the US album charts and held firm for six consecutive weeks, eventually going Platinum and receiving a Grammy Award nomination. One song from that album, "You're So Vain", was also nominated for Song Of The Year and Best Pop Vocal Performance and as of 2008 was listed at #72 on the Billboard definitive list of the Top 100 songs from the chart's first 50 years.
In 1988 Carly won an Academy Award, Grammy and a Golden Globe for her song “Let the River Run” from the Working Girl motion picture soundtrack. Only one of two artists to ever accomplish such a feat (the other being Bruce Springsteen for "Streets of Philadelphia"), Carly hasn’t rested on her laurels, instead she has continued to write not only more great songs, but film scores and children’s books as well.
Now Carly has a new album out entitled Never Been Gone which was produced by her son Ben Taylor on his Iris Records label. Never Been Gone is a collection of Carly’s hits, re-recorded this year with minimal backing instrumentation, allowing a refined, sultry, autumn sound to emerge. This fresh take on classic favorites also includes two news songs where we hear Carly continuing to evolve and grow as an artist. RockOm recently had the extraordinary opportunity to sit at length with Carly to discuss her new album and also explore music and healing, chant, meditation, the beauty of the human voice, prayer in its various forms and much more.
Tom: Your new album is entitled Never Been Gone and is out now on Iris Records. I think I speak for millions saying through your music I never felt you had been gone. The great songs on this album are timeless, yet simplistically and beautifully refined. Which songs surprised you the most in how they spoke to you after you re-recorded them?
Carly: I’m glad that you said that because I don’t want anybody to think this is a compilation. There have been quite a few compilations of my albums but this is really a reinterpretation as if I were singing in a foreign language. I limited myself to certain instruments such as not allowing myself to use drums except for on one song. My hits were always marked by my love of the huge tom-tom fill [laughs] and since we didn’t have any of those fills I feel much more exposed on this album. On songs like “Loving You is the Right Thing to Do”, I’m not awash in production. I also feel very exposed in “Coming Around Again". Certainly in the original the emotion came across but not in the way it does on Never Been Gone. When I listen to this album it affects me more, hurts me more, elates me more; it gets back to the core of what the emotion is of the song. When I was listening and mixing "Coming Around Again" it seemed very much like a chant in a way. It sort of moves you vibrationally sometimes like when you sit and chant. I’m not sure which organ it affects - whether it the spleen, the heart, or the liver - but there’s something about it that puts you in a “hum” mood.
Tom: I agree. It’s a liberating listening experience. I imagine it must have been the same for you doing these songs in an entirely different way.
Carly: Well, yes it was and certainly my son Ben [Taylor] had a huge hand in that. He wanted to know how I originally wrote them and then he wanted me to move from there, to take my toys and do them bare and stark. You know, it’s not that I’m not very much helped by Ben and David Saw and [other musicians on the album] but there’s something so different about this album. We’re all older; we’re all approaching it in a different way. There are some new musicians who were never in on the songs before. David Foster certainly put a very new spin on “Let The River Run.” I find that song can be sung in any way. It’s a hymn, so it cannot be sung as a sultry love song, but in terms of whether it’s chorally done or [performed] by one voice or by a duo or trio; it’s very versatile. We sang this in a beautiful and simple choral way, although there are aspects of my solo voice that come through. But it’s largely a guitar-based song; it doesn’t have the thrust of the original version that I did for Working Girl.
Tom: Since we’re talking about “Let The River Run”, your Academy Award-winning song from Working Girl which became somewhat of an anthem after 9-11, what do you think it’s going to take for us to find the “New Jerusalem” and create more harmony between each other on this planet?
Carly: Oh, what a good question. I think that if we all chanted at the same time, everyday, from country to country to country, without any time zones interfering that we would all be vibrating on the same plane, which has always been a great healer. Music has always been used to heal because it makes people feel a lot better. Not all music does; there are certain songs, intervals and chords which don’t make you feel very good. Pythagoras freed the minds of his disciples from the worries of the day by playing music, which would calm their minds and would also produce deep sleep and prophetic dreams. In the morning he would banish the lingering effects of sleep by playing stimulating melodies and rhythms. Major chords will do one thing to your mind and body and minor chords will do something else. Suspension chords will do something else. Then there’s the Devil’s interval which does something. So music and its properties are just fantastic the way they can alter your state of mind.
Tom: I think that’s why we come back to our favorite music over and over again when we want to recreate that original experience.
Carly: Yeah, when you think of it the ancient Hebrews or the prophets foretold the future through chanting and the sister of Moses was said to have immense visionary powers which were conveyed through chanting. Shamans cured diseases and mental anguish by coaxing the evil spirits into leaving their victims through the powers of chanting. There have been all kinds of enlightenment through music, but healing the sick is also a major [attribute]. There are so many curative powers in music. I think that music is the strongest of all the arts in terms of being able to cross all the boundaries and being able to do so many things, especially vibrationally to the body. Looking at a piece of art is very effective and impressive, but I don’t think that it does the same thing if you’re not also the participant. There’s something about the way music brings people together in a communal way; it's such a terrific thing. And it seems to me that the most powerful thing about church or temple for me was always the music.
Tom: Do you use music in meditation to relax? It’s widely known that you have some issues with stage fright and it’s ironic that you create this beautiful music and yet you have stage fright before going on. Does music help you to calm yourself?
Carly: [Laughs] I would love to be on stage and perform music - just the vocal aspect of it - with a whole lot of other people. I would love to sing in a choir or as some of the Irish folk musicians do; they’ll sing while being held from the back by another singer, and that person will be held by another person, and that person by another so that it’s like a chain of singers who are holding each other and they feel each other vibrationally. I would love that. When I’m singing by myself I feel incomplete a little bit. I wish that I could actually feel the warmth and the vibration of another human being right next to my body while I was singing.
Tom: Well you certainly have the vibration of millions of fans that you’ve performed for over the years supporting you. I hope you feel that at times.
Carly: Oh I do, I do! I love it when the audience sings with me. What I don’t like is the very stillness of a room and then just my voice. That’s what sort of scares me. I jump at the sound of it, it’s so solo. I think there are some people who really feed on that and feed on the complete solo-ness of their voice as a lone instrument in the dark. I like the togetherness of the community singing.
Tom: Let me ask you about the creative process. I know that besides being a musician you’re also a very successful film arranger and children's author. Can you explain where all the magical melodies and lyrics, the ideas and words for your books and music come from?
Carly: Oh I have a thousand stories and as I was explaining to somebody the other day, I think I was born with a faucet in my mind. It’s always dripping a melody but there are other things that will be in the way of it. For instance, I’ll be talking to you and I won't necessarily be thinking of the melody, but as soon as I’m still again the melody will come. So anytime I want to tap into it I can and then I‘ll go from there. I go from whatever melody I’m given to a lyric that will seem to go with it or to a better melody or to a chord that I play on an instrument. There's always a starting place. It happened to be with my children’s book that the starting place was in telling my own children stories that I would be making up, because it would be easier to put them to sleep when the lights were out and I was not reading a book. So I would turn off the lights and I would make up a story. Everything that I write has to be very real to me or I have to be able to identify with it.
Tom: Who do you turn to musically for inspiration?
Carly: It’s usually classical music. To be specific I would say the music of Debussy, Poulenc and Gershwin, who's obviously not just classical but he’s the modern composer who I’m most attracted to in terms of melody. There are so many people in pop music and in jazz that it would be to hard to limit myself. If I go to my CD collection it’s almost impossible to chose one myself. It’s easier to turn on the radio and see what happens by accident. There’s always something that I’m fascinated and/or moved by.
Tom: Included in the new album is your song “Coming Around Again.” You write about coming back home to Martha’s Vineyard:"I know nothing stays the same / But if you're willing / to play the game / It's coming around again / So don't mind if I fall apart / there's more room in a broken heart." The music has changed this time around but the words still hold a simple truth that is unchanging about a space - in this case your home - which holds peace and serenity. Other than your home what sustains you when all else fails?
Carly: I think it’s prayer, in its various forms. It’s prayer, where I stay quiet and see whether I can hear the voice of God and how the voice of God comes to me. If it’s in the form of music, then there’s some kind of spiritual prayer which is more sacred than it is secular and that can be any number of things. There’s a requiem by Fauré I happen to love. My thing is I have to remember to [pray]. When I’m not being sustained or when I lose myself or when I’m angry or when I’m in the wrong space I have to remember I can click it off. I have to remember that I can pray if I choose to do so.
There are many things that are meditative for me. Painting is meditative; I love to paint. I love to garden and to look at my beautiful trees that I’m so lucky to have. My son’s music is just exquisite. I listen to that; I listen to the beauty of his voice. Just the beauty of the human voice is really something; it’s a meditation all of its own. The voice of my daughter… there are so many beautiful voices that I just love. My favorite tenor is Yussi Beurling and some of the beautiful music that he sang, just that voice in itself can pull me in a whole different direction, as can various pop songs. I listen to a lot of Motown, especially to Otis Redding, Marvin Gaye and Sam Cooke. And dancing... I would be a whirling dervish if I lived in that time. In fact, I might start a little group of my own right here in my apartment. [Laughs] That would be fun!
Justin Epstein is a dynamic inspirational speaker who has given over one hundred and thirty presentations to thousands of people in Lincoln Center’s Avery Fisher Hall. He has shared the stage with such notables as Dr. Maya Angelou, Les Brown, Iyanla Vanzant and Marianne Williamson.
Justin Epstein graduated Magna Cum Laude from James Madison University, where he received a BS degree and double-majored in Communications and Religion/Philosophy. He is a graduate of Unity School for Religious Studies Ministerial Program in Missouri and was ordained a Unity Minister in 1993. He also resided at Ananda Village for three and a half years, a prolific school of Eastern thought.
He has produced and hosted the cable television series "Practical Spirituality" that aired in New York City. Justin served as the associate to prolific author and speaker Eric Butterworth, whose book Discover the Power within You was listed in Oprah's first edition of O Magazine as the book that changed her perspective on God and started her on her spiritual journey.
Justin is a student of the best-selling authors Dr. Wayne Dyer, Eckhart Tolle and the personal development gurus Anthony Robbins and Brian Tracy. He is also a graduate of the American Comedy Institute and has performed stand up comedy in clubs throughout New York City including Caroline's on Broadway. Justin is the president/CEO of Justin Epstein International, presenting seminars on Enlightened Golf: Merging Mind, Body and Spirit through the Game and also speaks to salespeople. He is the senior minister of the Unity Church of Hilton Head Island, SC.
RockOm: How was music emphasized during your stint at Ananda Village?
Justin Epstein: After I was ordained from Unity I decided to go out to Ananda Village in Northern California and learn more about the understanding of the teachings of Paramahansa Yogananda, which was a wonderful balance of the teaching of yoga, based on The Bhagavad Gita. It's the science of realizing God and experiencing God, here and now. Yogananda talked about Jesus and quoted the Bible and that really appealed to me.
Part of the teaching at Ananda Village is chanting. Yogananda said that chanting is half the battle, because in chanting you're repeating positive, spiritual words over and over and that's focusing your thoughts and your heart's feelings. The whole point is to take all those feelings in the heart and channel them towards God. Ultimately, it goes beyond feeling uplifted and arousing emotion and sentiment - it helps you to get quiet and to meditate. You take the energy you're bringing inside [from the music or chanting] and you channel it from the heart to the point between the eyebrows - the spiritual eye - which helps you experience not only the subconscious feeling, but the super-conscious level of mind, that level of creativity where we experience that presence of God.
We're talking about music here today and Jesus said that death and life are in the power of the tongue. Every word that you speak has an impact in your life. When we sing, we're taking thoughts and we're crystallizing them into words, singing those words and they impact our heart and change our physiology. They can change our behavior and uplift us. If the words are negative then they can bring us down.
RO: What is it about music that connects us with God?
JE: Music helps to get your feelings and thoughts all channeled towards one focus, to have all your energy moving in the direction of super-consciousness or God. That’s the main thing it does for me. When we’re happy we use words like "up", "uplifted", and "on top of the world." I believe when we're happy, our energy and focus flow upward. Music can help to take your energy, focus it and move it in an upward direction. You can use that energy to experience a deeper communion.
RO: What is your insights on the spiritual sounds "Om/Aum", "Amen", and "The Word"?
JE: In the teachings of Yogananda there's the transcendent presence of God who is beyond all form. That presence begins to vibrate itself as sound, as energy. It creates this word and creates you and me. It is the consciousness of God vibrating itself. The Om is that movement of sound energy and vibration that creates everything. It is the Amen in Judaism and Christianity, the Ameen of the Muslims, and the Omkar for the Zoroastrians. I believe The Word (from the Bible's Gospel of John) was the presence and activity that vibrates itself. That's the creative Word. It's creating everything. "In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God." You might call it the Holy Ghost or the Comforter. In chanting, ultimately, we want to be able to listen to the Om sound, to open up to that presence and that sound that is within us and to let it vibrate throughout our whole being.
RO: Or resonate with the larger Om.
JE: Exactly, listening to that vibration of Om brings us back into union with that one, transcendent presence. We're in tune with the music of the spheres.
RO: Are there other sacred texts or scriptures that have meant something to you as far as music is concerned?
JE: The Bible verse, "Make a joyful noise unto the Lord", certainly comes to mind. I don't believe the Lord needs our joyful noise, but I think we need it!
Be sure to catch the entire audio portion of our interview with Reverend Justin on Thursday's RockOm.net Podcast.
Psychedelic country-rock with a Kingston-inspired Reggae groove accompanying mystic Celtic chant and flute. It's how we roll at RockOm and we're rolling at you with three new RockOm Featured interviews today. Though different cultures separate them, each of these artists are creating music with a united purpose: to spread love, peace and some "righteous" joy.
The New Riders of The Purple Sage, California's psychedelic cowboys of 70's country-rock, have released their first album in 20 years. The New Riders' Buddy Cage joined RockOm for a revealing discussion on the new CD and band, and how it makes all the difference when you "play it in your own spirit."
The Wailers, led now by Aston "Family Man" Barrett continue spreading the message that "we're all Jah people." The band's reggae groove has been the soundtrack to the lives of hundreds of millions across the planet. Family Man joined RockOm before a recent performance to talk about the soul of Rastafari, the legacy of Bob Marley and an upcoming new Wailers CD featuring surprise guest artists.
A Celtic Mass for Peace: Songs for the Earth gives voice and sound to earth's deepest yearnings for peace. These are not just religious longings or Christian longings. These are sacred longings from the heights and depths of humanity's song. In a RockOm exclusive, composers Sam Guarnaccia and J. Philip Newell reveal how music and chant bring out the natural mystic in us all.
"The story of Hanuman - lord of the monkeys, son of the wind - is told in many cultures, including China, Thailand, Indonesia, and India. It's the story of how our animal nature can be sublimated through service and devotion. Some would say that Hanuman represents the mind which, when scattered and unaware of its Divine nature, jumps all around like a monkey. But once it fixes itself on its Beloved, it becomes the vehicle to merge with God.
"The song 'Hanuman 2' features 8 verses from the beautiful Hanuman Chalisa - an ancient hymn which invokes the energy of Hanuman. There are lots of versions of the Chalisa, but I wanted to create something fun and funky, with that jumping monkey energy! This song also came into being from the huge response I had to the song 'Hanuman' (from Reveal)." [Girish]
In yoga centers and practitioners' MP3 players worldwide stream the melodies and voice of artist Krishna Das. Krishna Das' legendary history began with befriending spiritual teacher Ram Dass and soon thereafter becoming a disciple of Maharaj-ji (Neem Karoli Baba). Today he records albums and tours the world leading kirtan (devotional music) and has sung for and with many of the world's foremost spiritual teachers and musical artists. KD recently shared with RockOm's Trevor Harden about his rock'n' roll past and the influence of his guru.
RockOm - In the yogic tradition, there are several pathways to connecting with or serving God. You've chosen the devotional path, which is carried out through song. From Krishna Das kirtan sessions to Sunday morning church services, why do you believe music is such a powerful agent in connecting us with the divine?
Krishna Das - That's a good question. Music is a way people can get out of their minds, get out of their thoughts. It's something they can do themselves with their body and with their voice. It's something they can give themselves to without any artificiality; it just moves you. The rhythms of music and the sound and all those things helps people get out of their heads. I saw the new Rolling Stones movie at the IMAX that Martin Scorsese directed and they played some stuff from way back, stuff from their early albums from when I was in college listening. I broke out crying because those songs were so important to me at that time. They helped me so much to get through hard periods. It was so powerful for me. Our emotions are able to move into the flow of music in a way that's very beautiful. With chanting, there's music involved but also something else which is called the Divine Names in the East - the names of God or the names of that place in us that's ok, the place that we forget a lot. By melting the music in with these sounds, we not only get that ability to move out of our minds, but we also move into something that's more lasting in our own hearts - in our own self. No matter how much that music of the Stones helped me when I was young, it didn't give me something lasting. I'm not trying to put music down in any way, but the spiritual aspect of music doesn't necessarily come from the music itself. It can come from the person who's doing the music. It can come from what's in the music, what's put into the music by that person. The intention of the musician is very important.
RO - You mentioned the Stones; were there other artists or albums when you were a young man or teenager that also spoke to you?
KD - The blues. Mississippi Delta blues, country blues. When I heard that music, I fell over. I grew up on Long Island in the '50s and '60s. The '50s were a very superficial time - Eisenhower was the president; it was a weird time. Everybody was repressed, nobody talked about anything. And then I ran into the blues and I could not believe it - the power, the presence, the wisdom and the intensity of the experience of these musicians like Mississippi John Hurt, Rev. Gary Davis, Skip James, and Robert Johnson. I couldn't believe how real this stuff was and how it cut through the nonsense of what I was living with every day. That music really changed my life, absolutely. And in some ways, what I do - I'm really still just a blues singer. It's big blues, but it's blues.
RO - It is well noted that your time in India brought you to the feet of Neem Karoli Baba. What, if anything, did your guru have to say about music?
KD - Not much other than, "Sing!" He wasn't a teacher. He didn't do a lot of intellectual talking. He didn't explain a lot of stuff but he guided each of us to finding our own way to help ourselves. He always asked me to sing - he asked all of us to sing - and the chanting became very important to me so I just kept up with it. Once again, he talked about the Name, the repetition of the Name. It is like calling out when you're in love with somebody, your heart is always calling them - calling their name and bringing their face and their presence to your mind. It's the same thing. Through this music, we're calling that Love - the essence of all that Love - to bring into ourselves, to bring it into our moment, into our lives. That's what the practice is about.
RO - You're currently on tour throughout the Eastern U.S., including June 28th at Charleston's Jivamukti Yoga and June 30th at Atlanta's Variety Playhouse. What have you learned over your years of touring and leading different kinds of people in different parts of the world in devotional singing?
KD - Get enough sleep! [laughs] For me, it's like being with family. No matter how many people are there, no matter where I am, no matter what language they talk it always feels like family to me. It's a wonderful feeling. I've found that everybody's the same, everybody wants the same thing. Everybody wants some relief from the intensity of the stuff that happens every day to us. We want to find a way to live with that. Everybody wants that love, everybody wants to find that place no matter where they are on this earth. You can see that a lot of us don't know how to go about doing that and that, instead of helping us find a way to deal with it, our very actions make more stuff to deal with. That's the same across the board everywhere. I've learned that everybody's the same.
RO - And you feel that through your sessions with these people it's helping them through this process a little?
KD - It's certainly helping me. I don't know about them. I would hope so, but I know it's helping me.
Krishna Das is currently on tour in Georgia, South and North Carolina and a few states in the Midwest, among others. Check out his tour schedule as well as much more information at www.krishnadas.com.
In this week's podcast episode (#66, "Stripping Away"), musicians Carly Simon and Heather Maloney share interviews with RockOm. Carly talks about stripping down her hits for the new album Never Been Gone and singer-songwriter Heather Maloney shares about the stripping away process that occurs in meditation.
Carly Simon needs no introduction. Since 1971 her music and hits such as "That's the Way I've Always Heard It Should Be", “Anticipation”, “You’re So Vain” and many others have been part of the soundtrack of millions of lives around the world. Her 1973 album No Secrets rocketed to #1 on the US album charts and held firm for six consecutive weeks, eventually going Platinum and receiving a Grammy Award nomination. One song from that album, "You're So Vain", was also nominated for Song Of The Year and Best Pop Vocal Performance and as of 2008 was listed at #72 on the Billboard definitive list of the Top 100 songs from the chart's first 50 years.
Tom: Since we’re talking about “Let The River Run”, your Academy Award-winning song from Working Girl which became somewhat of an anthem after 9-11, what do you think it’s going to take for us to find the “New Jerusalem” and create more harmony between each other on this planet?
Tom: Let me ask you about the creative process. I know that besides being a musician you’re also a very successful film arranger and children's author. Can you explain where all the magical melodies and lyrics, the ideas and words for your books and music come from?
Justin Epstein is a dynamic inspirational speaker who has given over one hundred and thirty presentations to thousands of people in Lincoln Center’s Avery Fisher Hall. He has shared the stage with such notables as Dr. Maya Angelou, Les Brown, Iyanla Vanzant and Marianne Williamson.
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